Park Wonseok: "Kim Eojun Has Crossed the Line, Lee Eonju Must Show Restraint," Lee Taegyu: "The Indictment-Cancellation Group Is Undemocratic and Anti-Democratic" [Current Affairs Show]

Park Wonseok: "Loyalty Competition Inside Democratic Party Is Inappropriate"
Lee Taegyu: "Jang Donghyuk Going the Wrong Way, Everything Must Change"
Park Wonseok: "People Power Party Is Beyond Saving, Almost a Dead Party"

So Jongsup: Hello, everyone. This is So Jongsup's Current Affairs Show. Today, we have with us two former lawmakers, Lee Taegyu, formerly of the People Power Party, and Park Wonseok, formerly of the Justice Party, for a vivid talk on today’s hot issues. Thank you both for coming. According to the Realmeter poll reported today, President Lee Jaemyung’s approval rating has risen for four consecutive weeks, reaching 58.2%, and the gap in party support between the Democratic Party and the People Power Party has widened even further.

Park Wonseok: I think the public feels that the president is working hard, that he is doing his job well, and that he has a good grasp of key state affairs. I believe the live broadcasts of Cabinet meetings and live broadcasts of work briefings are having a certain effect, and if you look at the points the president raises and the instructions he gives during those live-broadcast meetings, they are very specific. That seems to give the public a sense of stability.

On top of that, there is a very large base effect from the previous administration. Under the previous government, state affairs were a complete mess, and the public had various concerns and criticisms about that. Compared with that, the president appears to be doing his job well, working hard, and understanding key state issues in considerable detail. I also think that, initially, there was a very high level of anxiety in terms of diplomacy and security. But since the inauguration, through several summit diplomacies, the president has unexpectedly shown a rather stable demeanor. That seems to bring the public a great deal of satisfaction. And another factor is the so-called “reflected benefit.” Because the opposition is in such a shambles, the president’s management of state affairs stands out even more, and I think that aspect is being reflected quite evenly in the numbers.

Former lawmaker Park Wonseok (right) and former lawmaker Lee Taegyu appeared on The Asia Business Daily's 'So Jongsup's Current Affairs Show' on the 23rd. Photo by Heo Yeonghan

So Jongsup: How do you see it, Assemblyman Lee? What is your outlook?

Lee Taegyu: I believe there are three basic pillars for evaluating President Lee Jaemyung’s job approval rating. One is the Yoon Sukyeol base effect. The idea is that it would be hard to do worse than Yoon Sukyeol. The second is that he is working hard. And the third is the Lee Jaemyung base effect. When President Lee was a candidate, including the Daejang-dong issue, his negative image and distrust levels were actually very high. In reality, it is accurate to say that he was elected president as a kind of reflected effect of the impeachment of the previous president through the coup d’etat. But he is doing a better job than expected and is steering things like tariff negotiations and various diplomatic and security matters without major trouble so far.

Lastly, again, there is the reflected benefit. As a force of checks and a potential alternative, the People Power Party is currently showing this kind of behavior, floundering in the quagmire of the coup d’etat. Because the credibility of the People Power Party as an alternative and as a check-and-balance force is so low, I think that is being reflected relatively in the president’s job approval.

Right now, the People Power Party is in constant turmoil over how to sever ties with Yoon Sukyeol and how to cut off “Yoon Again.”I believe that resolving issues such as martial law, impeachment, and coup d’etat is the fundamental contradiction the People Power Party currently faces, and if they fail to untangle this basic contradiction, there is virtually no chance for the People Power Party to rise. So regardless of whether the president performs well or not, I think there is a high possibility that his stable job approval will continue for the time being.

Former lawmaker Lee Taegyu predicted that President Lee's approval rating is likely to remain stable for the time being.

So Jongsup: President Lee Jaemyung shared Seongdong District Mayor Jeong Wonoh’s social media post, then made Representative Jeon Jaesoo’s post public, and this time he shared Representative Park Chandae’s post on social media.

Lee Taegyu: I see this as a calculation to push people who will do politics with him and who understand his governing philosophy well, to give them nominations, thereby enabling him to take control of the party and also strengthen his grip on state affairs. From the standpoint of a president who holds the hegemonic power early in his term, I think it is almost inevitable to proceed that way, based on a common-sense political judgment. However,even so, if the president moves and stirs up the party sentiment, it has the effect of distorting that sentiment in a very real way. I believe that runs counter to intra-party democracy, and the president ultimately has to become the president of all party members, of every member, but there is also the risk that he could degenerate into merely the head of one faction.

He is currently backing four people: Jeong Wonoh, Park Chandae, Han Junho, and Jeon Jaesoo. If one of them fails to win, the president will inevitably suffer some political blow or damage. He clearly has the intention of forming the next-generation group he wants, and there is also clearly an intention to take control of the party and strengthen his control over state affairs.

So Jongsup: Some call this “elevating Myeongsim.” Isn’t there a political risk to this?

Park Wonseok: If he walks the line well, I think it is fine, but if he crosses the line and goes too far, there will be a “too much is as bad as too little” effect.In the case of the Seoul mayoral election, I do not think this is about backing a candidate with an eye on internal party competition. My sense is that, under the strategic goal of absolutely recapturing Seoul, they picked and decided to elevate a candidate who can beat Mayor Jeong Wonoh, and that is working to a certain extent. In Busan, in fact, there is no candidate other than Representative Jeon Jaesoo. Various numbers now show that the former lawmaker has considerable competitiveness, so I see the president as giving him a gentle boost, and it is similar in Incheon.

The Gyeonggi governor race seems somewhat different. The plaque of appreciation for his special envoy trip was posted on social media by Representative Han Junho, and that is how we found out; the president did not post it himself. That race could be risky if mishandled. This is because Representative Choo Miae is also showing considerable competitiveness, and the incumbent governor is from the Democratic Party. The possible scenarios are different. If the president throws his weight behind one side, it truly becomes a factor for intra-party strife.

So Jongsup: President Lee Jaemyung’s best-known fan cafe is “Jaemying’s Village.” There, they simply expelled Party Leader Jeong Cheongrae and Supreme Council Member Lee Sungyun through a vote. Assemblyman Park, what on earth is happening inside the ruling camp right now?

Former lawmaker Park Wonseok criticized, saying, "A loyalty competition is underway within the ruling party," and "Events that should not be happening are occurring at an inappropriate time."

Park Wonseok: So I actually went into that cafe. Since they said they had expelled them, I wanted to see how many members had actually wanted that result, and it turned out only 1,200 people had voted.The cafe has 200,000 members, and they expelled them on the grounds that 80% of the 1,200 voters supported it. This is exactly what we have been criticizing as a problem: in what is called fandom politics, hardline fandoms run wild, and it is like the tail wagging the dog.

I also had this thought: this is self-inflicted. Party Leader Jeong Cheongrae himself once said that the bulletin board of Ddanzi Ilbo is a barometer of public sentiment. But in a way, the Ddanzi Ilbo bulletin board has now become a community that stands on the opposite side from the Innovation Party for the Fatherland in the process of the merger and the special prosecutor candidate recommendation. He has been rejected by Jaemying’s Village. The Democratic Party is no longer an opposition party challenging power; it is the ruling party, and a massive ruling party at that, and this is a government after a coup d’etat, so this is extremely important. Yet if they still behave like an opposition party, I think that is unacceptable, and I hope this serves as an opportunity for serious self-reflection within the Democratic Party. The president’s term is only eight months in, but the party is already split into pro-Lee and anti-Lee camps, looking like they are engaged in gang fights. This is a kind of loyalty competition.

The friction in the process of integrating with the Innovation Party for the Fatherland, and further, the nomination battles for the next general election and the competition for the next presidency are all exploding at once, while the front line against the opposition is rather quiet. Since the opposition is not much of a threat, this is how power always behaves. When the external front line becomes quiet, the fights move inside. This is a very typical way of turning inward. An unacceptable thing is happening at an inappropriate time.

Lee Taegyu: The very fact that there are internal conflicts and fights within the ruling party so early in the presidential term is, in my view, a factor that can cause instability in state affairs, so from the president’s standpoint, this is highly undesirable. I think he will try to put out the fire somehow. Because which president would want this? He needs to focus on state affairs, with selection and concentration, but the party is splitting into factions and fighting. Even if that benefits the pro-Lee or Lee Jaemyung faction, it does nothing to help the president.

Park Wonseok: But I think people outside the National Assembly need to come to their senses, because they have too much sway over the party. This includes Kim Eojun and former Minister Rhyu Simin. None of them are party members. Kim Eojun, in the past, was a very meaningful and major helper, but now he is trying to become the architect himself. That crosses the line. I think criticism of Kim is only natural. But if you look at some of those who call themselves the “New Lee Jaemyung” camp, they are people who came over from the conservative side or newly joined supporters, but under the banner of centrist expansion and pragmatism and the need for unifying politics, they themselves are engaging in divisive politics. They also need to exercise restraint. Someone like Representative Lee Eonju needs to exercise restraint.

Former lawmaker Park said, "Kim Eojun and lawmaker Lee Eonju should exercise restraint," and former lawmaker Lee criticized, saying, "The opposition is not doing its job, so the ruling party has no sense of crisis." Reporter Heo Yeonghan

So Jongsup: A common point in what both of you are saying is that the ruling camp needs to exercise restraint and show stability.

Lee Taegyu: Let me add one point about the opposition. Because the opposition is not strong, neither the Democratic Party nor the presidential office seems to have any real sense of tension or crisis about the success or preservation of the administration. If they had a sense of crisis or tension, it would be hard to show the public this kind of behavior. I get the impression that the Lee Jaemyung administration and the Democratic Party are relying excessively on the coup d’etat effect to manage the political situation. But the coup d’etat effect is not a card that can be used endlessly and inexhaustibly.The opposition must do its job, but at some point when, in my view, the opposition finds its role, the Democratic Party will need to ask itself whether it can really manage the political situation properly while behaving the way it is now.

So Jongsup: A group called “Lawmakers for the Cancellation of the Indictment in President Lee Jaemyung’s Case and for a Parliamentary Investigation into the Case” has been launched, with 105 Democratic Party lawmakers participating. What do you make of this?

Lee Taegyu: The proper course regarding President Lee Jaemyung’s trials is to leave the matter to the judiciary. If he feels wronged, he can appeal, and ultimately the case can go up to the Supreme Court. But in this case, they are trying to use the power of the administration to pressure the judiciary into dismissing the indictment or achieving some similar outcome. Is that truly appropriate in a democratic country? From this standpoint, I believe the group for cancelling the indictment deserves strong criticism. If, after his term, President Lee Jaemyung faces trial and a conviction seems certain but he really does not want to go to prison, then he should do a good job as president.

If he becomes a truly successful president and completes his term, then even if a guilty verdict is handed down, a public opinion could form that asks, “Do we really have to send a president who worked so hard to prison?” and that public sentiment could be reflected in sentencing. That is the right path in a democratic country. But if they change the law, increase the number of Supreme Court justices, and introduce a new constitutional complaint system in order to neutralize this through the power of the administration, then I think that is where democracy collapses. More than 100 lawmakers gathering to neutralize the trial of one individual president? There is nothing more undemocratic and anti-democratic than that.

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So Jongsup: But more than 60% of Democratic Party lawmakers are participating in this group.

Park Wonseok: I think there are two aspects. One is the political background. Although they are calling for the cancellation of the indictment, essentially it seems to be about building a power bloc, that is, establishing one axis of power within the party through this group. The other is whether it is appropriate for ruling party lawmakers to engage in such political pressure tactics under the banner of cancelling the president’s indictment, even if such motives exist.

On the latter point, I agree with Assemblyman Lee’s criticism. They cannot gain legitimacy by pressuring for the cancellation of President Lee Jaemyung’s indictment on the grounds of remedying the fabricated indictment by the Yoon Sukyeol prosecution. These are separate issues. Furthermore, once an indictment has been filed, it means the criminal justice process has begun. The issue must be resolved and remedied within the judicial process. Even if it is a fabricated indictment, that must be proven legally; political assertions do not make it fact. Moreover, the criminal justice system in the Republic of Korea is designed on the premise that wrongful indictments may occur. That is why at the investigation and indictment stages, the appropriateness of indictment is reviewed, and even after indictment, there are first, second, third trials and even retrial procedures.

If a criminally fabricated indictment has occurred and that can be proven legally, then a special prosecutor should be appointed. But can gathering about 100 ruling party lawmakers, collecting 10 million signatures, and conducting a parliamentary investigation legally prove that the indictment was fabricated? It cannot. All they are doing is putting pressure on the prosecution to cancel the indictment. It is a kind of public-opinion campaign, but the question is whether this is what the ruling party should be doing in such a critical political moment. In that sense, I think writer Rhyu Simin’s comment that “this is crazy” is harsh but not wrong. This weakens the legitimacy of the rule of law and undermines the moral foundations of this administration. It could end up being an act of self-harm. When the logic is unclear and forced, things can collapse in an instant. This is absolutely not the way to support the president. It is an abnormal competition in loyalty.

So Jongsup: The People Power Party has also postponed its party name change until after the election. How do you assess the situation in the People Power Party?

Lee Taegyu: I think postponing the party name change until after the election is something they have done right for the first time in a long while. When people saw the two shortlisted candidate names, so many were dumbfounded. Many wondered, “Is this really the level at which the party leadership conducts its work?” and went through a very frustrating process. When a restaurant is not doing well, you replace the chef, change the menu, and improve the quality of the food. Only on that basis does changing the signboard bring customers back. But in my view, the People Power Party’s party name change process was exactly the opposite: they tried to change only the signboard without changing anything else, and the customers will not come back for that.

There should have been reform measures accompanying the party name change, but without any reform plan, they just said they would change the signboard. Who could agree with or relate to that? The party leadership needs to reflect deeply on this. I hope that the failure of the party name change becomes an opportunity for them to do things properly, but Representative Jang Donghyuk has already blatantly revealed his own political identity.In that environment, can any winning, transformative political content really emerge? Many people are skeptical and deeply concerned.

He is currently going in exactly the opposite direction. The public and party members keep giving him chances, but Representative Jang Donghyuk is kicking those chances away. And in the end, does only he personally fail? Jang Donghyuk as an individual might choose that path, but Jang Donghyuk as party leader cannot. Many people are calling the People Power Party a “Galapagos party,” isolated and alone. It is trapped by itself and, in fact, confined to a small group of hardline supporters. If it is to be a mass party, it must become a party that can represent the public’s broad sentiment and the universal trends of the times.To mount even a minimal defense in the local elections, I believe everything must change. I am not saying they must change the party leader, but that they must change their thinking and behavior altogether. Yet while they talk about change, their actions and content show not winning change but almost regressive behavior. It is not too late even now.

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So Jongsup: Assemblyman Park, how do you see it?

Park Wonseok: In its current state, the People Power Party seems to have entered a hopeless phase. It appears to have become a political force that has completely lost its resilience.At the press conference on the 20th, when Party Leader Jang Donghyuk said that only the first trial had ended and that martial law was not a coup d’etat, I think he very clearly declared “Yoon Again.”Using the first-trial ruling as an opportunity, he has instead revealed his true intentions and his political identity.I see this not as Jang Donghyuk’s personal will but as the collective will of the so-called “Yoon Again” faction being manifested.The important actors are the incumbent People Power Party lawmakers.

In my view, Party Leader Jang is not interested in the local elections. Whatever happens there, he will focus on solidifying his grip on party power, and even if the local election results are poor, he will respond by saying the party members should decide.Inside the People Power Party, there is a kind of lethargy and self-preservation,and I think extreme selfishness is rampant. Every lawmaker only cares about themselves. In Daegu, the mayoral race has ten candidates, while in Gyeonggi Province, there are none. For a national party,does that make any sense?At this point, telling Party Leader Jang Donghyuk to change is pointless. This leadership structure must be rejected. Lawmakers should throw down all their party posts and say, “We will refuse and fight until you step down,” but they are not doing that. Their silence is complicity; they are irresponsibly postponing everything. They think, “Something will happen after the local elections,” or “Time will pass and things will sort themselves out,” but nothing will happen. It is almost a dead party.

So Jongsup: The moderate and rational faction within the People Power Party must be deeply troubled.

Lee Taegyu: The level of that concern will depend on the local election results. Many people see President Lee Jaemyung as running toward the political center, while Party Leader Jang Donghyuk is running toward the far-right cliff. There are people who think they know how this will end. They believe that even if they lose the local elections, as the general election approaches, the Democratic Party will not be able to hold on forever, and when the public eventually turns its back on them, their time will come again. Such sentiments are particularly strong in the TK region.

Because there is no real concern for the country’s or conservatism’s future, in practice, since industrialization and democratization, neither the progressives nor the conservatives have ever crafted a new political narrative. They have never seriously tried to create a new discourse. So the question is not simply whether to cut ties with Yoon Sukyeol. Cutting ties with Yoon Sukyeol is a matter of common sense. If you have common sense, even a third grader in elementary school would answer that in three seconds. The bigger question is: what will you build beyond Yoon Sukyeol? Even the politicians who oppose Jang Donghyuk have no answer to that. Mayor Oh Sehoon is not articulating it, and neither is Han Donghoon.

Park Wonseok: Former party leader Han Donghoon is said to be starting rallies in Daegu this Friday,and, well, as an independent he is free to act, but I am not sure what his plan is. Is he going to form a new party, or is he waiting for the Jang Donghyuk leadership system to end? I do not really understand the political program on that side either.