Defector Youth Kim Ilhyeok "Some Defect to See K-pop... North Regime Collapse Is a Matter of Time" [Interview]

"North Korean Residents Should Have More Access to External Information"
"Most South Korean Defectors Maintain Contact with Their North Korean Families"

North Korean defector youth Kim Il-hyeok. Photo by Hyunmin Kim kimhyun81@

Kim Il-hyeok (29), a 'North Korean defector youth,' escaped North Korea with his family by crossing the Tumen River when he was 16 in 2011. It was about a year after his father had been taken to a labor training camp for four years for secretly using a cellphone. When his father was arrested, the North Korean security forces raided their home and confiscated all their appliances, including their bicycle. Although they did not starve, their staple food was the yellow "kkangnaebap (cornmeal rice)." If not soaked in water, it felt like chewing sand grains and was hard to digest.

Kim said that when he lived in North Korea as a child, he firmly believed in the regime. When he heard the news of the successful launch of North Korea's satellite, Kwangmyongsong, he and his friends sat around and even shed tears. However, after being exposed to outside culture through CDs and actually coming to South Korea to see the reality, his thoughts completely changed. He pointed out that the more North Korean youths are exposed to outside culture, the more they will dream of defecting, and that the collapse of the North Korean regime is only a matter of time.

Having risked his life crossing the Tumen River, Kim is deeply concerned about the forced repatriation issue of North Korean defectors in China. He knows well what happens to defectors who are sent back. We met Kim at a cafe in Nowon-gu, Seoul, at 4 p.m. on the 30th of last month. Although he has been settled in South Korea for 13 years, all his interests remain focused on North Korea. Kim gained worldwide attention last August when he spoke at the UN Security Council official meeting in New York, denouncing that "North Korean residents have no human rights." Recently, he has been contributing articles related to North Korea to overseas media, supporting efforts to resolve forced repatriation and North Korean human rights issues.

North Korean defector youth Kim Il-hyeok is being interviewed by Asia Economy at a cafe in Nowon-gu, Seoul, on the afternoon of the 30th of last month. Photo by Kim Hyun-min kimhyun81@

-Last year, 196 North Korean defectors entered South Korea, about half of whom were in their 20s and 30s. What is the reason for the increase in young defectors?

▲It seems to be because North Korean youths are exposed to a lot of outside information. As young people access outside information, they realize that "there is no hope in North Korean society" and develop a desire to live a better life outside North Korea and have new experiences. Even if someone has lived in North Korea, if they have not been exposed to outside information, they cannot easily leave.

-How did you access outside information while in North Korea?

▲I lived in Saetbyeol County, North Hamgyong Province, near the Chinese border. It was about 30 minutes from China. Because of this, many people secretly traded with China. Outside information came in easily. North Hamgyong has the highest number of defectors, which also influences this. In the past, we watched dramas on videotapes and CDs. Now, people watch them on USB drives. USBs are small, so they are easier to smuggle in. It seems North Korea is gradually becoming easier to access outside information.

-Did you watch South Korean dramas in North Korea?

▲The first South Korean drama I watched on CD was "Stay Strong, Geumsun-ah" (2005). I enjoyed it but also doubted whether the story in the drama was true. I also listened to a lot of music. I remember songs like "Bawiseom," "Namhaeng Yeolcha," and "Sarang-ui Miro." At the time, I thought they were North Korean songs, but after coming here, I realized they were South Korean music.

-I guess you watch much more now.

▲It must have spread much more. When I defected in July 2011, people had just started carrying cellphones in the city. Now, about 5 million people have cellphones. Recent phones even support video calls. There are about 34,000 defectors in South Korea now, and most of them keep in touch with their families in North Korea. Through this, a lot of outside information flows in.

-The number of 'elite' defectors has also increased.

▲By 'elite,' I mean people who live in Pyongyang or come from well-off families in the provinces and have graduated from university. Some parents in such families want to raise their children outside North Korea in a wider world. In fact, some manipulate documents to show their children as missing or deceased to send them abroad to countries like South Korea. North Korea allows this.

-In surveys asking about reasons for defection, more people now say 'dislike of the North Korean regime' rather than 'food shortage.'

▲As the North Korean regime has passed through three generations of succession, people's belief in the "Baekdu bloodline" seems to be decreasing. Especially those exposed to outside information realize this is wrong and lose trust in the Kim Jong-un regime. People who have never been exposed to outside culture find it hard to develop resentment toward the regime, but once they are exposed even once, they start questioning the regime.

On August 17 last year (local time), at a UN Security Council meeting on North Korean human rights held at the United Nations Headquarters in New York, defector Kim Il-hyeok (right) is speaking while Elizabeth Salm?n, the UN Special Rapporteur on North Korean Human Rights, observes. (Photo by Yonhap News)

-You said that to solve North Korean human rights issues, North Korean residents need to be exposed to more outside information so that they themselves develop resentment toward the regime.

▲There is no other way. We cannot go to war with North Korea immediately, and even if sanctions are imposed, Russia and China support North Korea. If outside information continues to be introduced into North Korea, the regime will be shaken and eventually collapse. Now, North Korean residents are much more exposed to South Korean dramas, K-pop, and entertainers. Among my female acquaintances, some defected because they wanted to see K-pop in person. Culture is very powerful.

-That is why North Korea has enacted the Anti-Reactionary Thought and Culture Law and enforces strict punishments and blockades.

▲Yes. But even if they block it, not everything can be stopped. No matter how tightly you seal a house, oxygen still comes in somewhere. North Korea enforces strict punishments, but many people still access outside culture. To prevent this, they use fear politics with harsh punishments, and at the same time, to soften the atmosphere, they seem to involve their wives, sisters, and daughters.

-Recently, our government recommended China to protect North Korean defectors and comply with international regulations for the first time at the Universal Periodic Review (UPR) held at the UN Geneva Office.

▲That is very meaningful. I hope they continue to respond effectively. This year, there will be a UPR on North Korea in November, and it is also the 10th anniversary of the UN Commission of Inquiry (COI) report on North Korean human rights. This year is really important for North Korean human rights. I am also contributing articles related to North Korean human rights to foreign media with my colleagues at VNKY (Voices of North Korea Youths), an international activity team affiliated with the North Korea Research Institute. Our articles have been published in overseas media such as Indonesia, Iraq, the EU, and NK News.

-For North Korean residents trying to defect, forced repatriation must be the greatest fear.

▲Yes. From the moment they cross the Tumen River, they risk their lives. If shots are fired from behind, they must die. Even after barely crossing, they have to traverse China, pass through Laos, and reach Thailand. They sometimes take buses or taxis or cross mountains to escape China. We crossed the Chinese mainland for five days. Chinese public security officers conduct many inspections along the way. If caught there, they are repatriated. Laos is also a communist country, so it is very dangerous.

Most are caught in China. It is said that there are about 50,000 to 100,000 defectors in China. Those not caught live secretly. They buy IDs or move locations regularly. Every day is uncertain for them. Because China offers rewards for reporting defectors, many people report them. Only a very small number of defectors make it to South Korea. If caught by Chinese public security and repatriated, depending on the case, they may be executed by shooting, sent to political prison camps, reeducation centers, or labor training camps. My father was also sentenced to four years in a labor training camp for using a cellphone and barely survived to return.

-How should the issue of China's forced repatriation be resolved?

▲It must be publicized worldwide. China wants to become the world's number one superpower. To do that, it needs a good international image. If China is stigmatized and criticized as a country that drives North Korean people to death, China may realize that not forcibly repatriating defectors is in its national interest. We must keep working until that happens.

-North Korea's recent military provocations have intensified. What do you think their purpose is?

▲North Korean people feel proud when missiles are launched. When I was in North Korea, I remember coming back exhausted from rural mobilization and watching the news about the successful launch of Kwangmyongsong with tears. North Korea conducts military provocations to attract external attention and promote internal unity. By provoking militarily, they can also display the state's false prestige to residents inside North Korea. North Korea will continue to provoke in the future.

North Korean defector youth Kim Il-hyeok is being interviewed by Asia Economy at a cafe in Nowon-gu, Seoul, on the afternoon of the 30th of last month. Photo by Kim Hyun-min kimhyun81@