[Interview] Former ILO Working Hours Expert John Messenger
"Flexible Working Hours Are Reasonable, 69 Hours per Week Is Negative"
"It is important not to forget that the belief that 'long working hours lead to better productivity' is merely an unfounded myth. Shorter working hours are more closely related to higher labor productivity per unit."
Jon C. Messenger, a 'working hours expert' who has been studying working conditions worldwide for over 20 years at the International Labour Organization (ILO) and former team leader of the ILO Working Conditions Group, said this in a written interview with Asia Economy on the 26th.
Jon C. Messenger, former team leader of the ILO Decent Work Team (Photo by Jon C. Messenger)
Earlier this month, the Ministry of Employment and Labor announced plans to expand the calculation basis for extended working hours from a weekly to monthly, quarterly, semi-annual, and annual basis, establishing a system that allows 'working intensively during busy periods and taking long vacations when there is leisure.' However, fierce opposition quickly arose, and President Yoon Suk-yeol suggested a kind of upper limit, saying 'working more than 60 hours a week is excessive.' The necessity to abolish the comprehensive wage system was also raised. The Ministry of Employment and Labor is reviewing supplementary measures.
"I believe it is certainly reasonable for Korea to introduce a flexible working hours system. However, if the maximum working hours during the week are allowed up to 69 hours under certain conditions, it will negatively affect workers' health, work-life balance (Work and Life balance, WLB), and productivity."
Messenger, the former leader, said this in response to a question about the active discussions on working hours reform in Korea.
In a report titled 'Working Hours and Work-Life Balance Worldwide' submitted to the ILO in January, he analyzed that reducing working hours and expanding flexibility improve workers' WLB and increase productivity. He emphasized, "Based on the experience of the COVID-19 crisis, if we closely examine the length and structure of working hours, it shows that a 'win-win' can be created that enhances both business performance and WLB."
◆ "Flexible working hours in Korea is reasonable"… Allowing 69 hours is 'negative'
Messenger, the former leader, said in the interview, "Korea has made significant progress in reducing working hours over the past few decades. In this context, I consider the introduction of flexible working hours to be reasonable."
He mentioned Korea's working hours changes in the report released in January. He explained that during Korea's industrialization period, the average annual working hours increased extremely but began to decrease from the 1990s and declined more sharply after the introduction of the 40-hour workweek system (excluding overtime) in the 2000s. He also introduced the process of Korea's '52-hour workweek introduction' in detail as a separate section.
Content related to the reduction of working hours in Korea from the report "Working Hours and Work-Life Balance Worldwide," released in January and led by former ILO leader John Messenger (Photo by ILO report)
Messenger said, "(Korea's) introduction of flexible working hours could lead to further reductions in working hours, lowering the average weekly working hours below 40."
However, he pointed out that if the Korean government's reform plan allowing a maximum of 69 working hours during the week is implemented in reality, it could harm workers' health, WLB, and reduce productivity. This was his response after hearing the government's three rules to protect workers' health: ▲ granting 11 consecutive hours of rest between working days or complying with a 64-hour weekly cap ▲ complying with an average of 64 hours over four weeks ▲ reducing total overtime proportionally to the management unit.
He said, "There is substantial empirical evidence that regularly working more than 50 hours a week negatively affects workers' health (Occupational Safety and Health, OSH), WLB, and productivity." Regarding working 48.5 to 52 hours weekly under total overtime limits, he said, "Although weekly working hours are still relatively high, if the actual weekly average is maintained as planned, it could help protect workers' health."
However, he pointed out, "If the maximum weekly working hours reach 64 hours, or even 69 hours under certain conditions, and actual weekly working hours reach such a very high level, it is expected to negatively impact OSH, WLB, and productivity."
After the government's announcement, the biggest issue among office workers was the problem of 'unpaid overtime.' When asked about the government's efforts to eliminate this, Messenger said, "If the goal is to eliminate unpaid overwork, it would be effective to strengthen labor-related surveys and rigorously enforce regulations related to overwork." Currently, the Ministry of Employment and Labor is reportedly considering mandatory recording of working hours to resolve this issue. He also suggested designating national holidays when companies must close to encourage the use of paid leave.
Messenger said that to strengthen workers' choice, "It is important to establish a mechanism where workers can set their own work schedules," adding, "Within a certain framework, a work system that allows workers to choose their start and end times is necessary so that workers can exercise choice over their working hours."
◆ "'Partial telework' is optimal… Manage employees based on results"
Having researched working environments for over 30 years, Messenger had studied telework trends even before the COVID-19 pandemic. In November 2019, before the pandemic, he published a book titled 'Telework in the 21st Century' as part of the ILO research series. In March 2020, right after the pandemic outbreak when workers worldwide were suddenly confined to their homes instead of offices, he appeared in an ILO video titled 'Tips for Effective Remote Work.'
John Messenger, former leader featured in the ILO's 'Tips for Effective Remote Work' video released in March 2020 during the early stages of the COVID-19 pandemic (Photo by ILO)
He said, "Remote work during the pandemic was conducted under the worst conditions, but it proved that remote work is at least as productive as office work," adding, "Many studies, including my ILO research, have concluded that the optimal work method is 'partial telework,' where some working hours are remote and some are in the office." He introduced that after the pandemic, this has come to be called 'hybrid work' nowadays.
Messenger emphasized, "Hybrid work is generally the best approach and a clear option for industries and jobs where remote work is possible," adding, "However, hybrid work can take many diverse forms, so it is important to carefully analyze the available hybrid work models and decide which fits our organization best." He strongly recommended close consultation with employees during the decision-making process.
When asked how to manage employees who cannot be met face-to-face in the office, Messenger suggested 'Management by Results' as the most effective method. He explained that managers and employees should agree on common productivity measurement mechanisms, allowing employees flexibility and autonomy to organize their work based on circumstances, so managers do not need to continuously monitor progress.
◆ About Jon Messenger, former ILO leader
Messenger worked at the U.S. Department of Labor from 1985 to 2000, then served as senior research officer and team leader of the Working Conditions Group at the ILO from 2000 until January this year. He led the drafting of the ILO's 'Guide to Balanced Working Hours' in 2019 and published the 'Working Hours and Work-Life Balance Worldwide' report in January. After retiring shortly after the report's release, he left Geneva, Switzerland, where the ILO headquarters is located, and now lives in his hometown of Philadelphia, USA. He responded to Asia Economy's interview request emphasizing that his views are personal and not official ILO positions.
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