[Kim Woong Talks About the Prosecution] "We Must Stop the 'Yoon Seok-yeol Investigation Office'"

Former Chief Prosecutor Kim Woong, who entered politics through the New Conservative Party, is being interviewed on the 18th at the National Assembly Members' Office Building in Yeouido, Seoul. Photo by Jin-Hyung Kang aymsdream@

[Asia Economy Reporter Park Cheol-eung] Former Chief Prosecutor Kim Woong, recruited by the United Future Party, emphasized the need to amend the High-ranking Officials' Crime Investigation Office (HOCI) law and the prosecution-police investigation authority adjustment bill, stating that the HOCI would become a "'Yoon Seok-yeol investigation office'." He criticized the Moon Jae-in administration, describing it as characterized by "double standards" and "us-versus-them mentality."

In an interview with Asia Economy on the 18th, former Prosecutor Kim said, "I am not strongly opposed to the HOCI itself, but if it is misused with bad intentions, it can be abused endlessly," adding, "If not supplemented, it will truly become a 'Yoon Seok-yeol investigation office.'"

He continued, "Didn't a Blue House secretary reveal it himself? It cannot be seen as an individual's voice. The HOCI should be strictly limited to investigating only cases requested by the National Assembly, and it is important to create such laws," he emphasized.

Choi Kang-wook, the Blue House Public Office Discipline Secretary, who was indicted on charges of forging an internship confirmation letter for the son of former Minister of Justice Cho Kuk, stated last month in a position paper, "Through investigations by the Ministry of Justice, the Supreme Prosecutors' Office, and the upcoming HOCI, their criminal acts will be fully exposed." Former Prosecutor Kim views Choi's stance as not different from that of the regime. After the passage of the investigation authority adjustment bill, Kim resigned in protest, calling it a "huge fraud," and gained fame through his book "Inside the Prosecutor's Office."

Former Chief Prosecutor Kim Woong, who entered politics through the New Conservative Party, is being interviewed on the 18th at the National Assembly Members' Office Building in Yeouido, Seoul. Photo by Kang Jin-hyung aymsdream@

Former Prosecutor Kim said about the HOCI, "Investigations into the living power are excluded, or there is a very high possibility of abuse that can pressure the investigation subject regarding the living power. Almost all legal scholars commonly point this out," adding, "Rep. Kwon Eun-hee of the Bareunmirae Party pointed out many problems at the end and tried to create alternatives. At least that level of supplementary measures should be in place."

He also expressed the view that investigative control mechanisms have disappeared. Kim said, "It eliminates both judicial control by prosecutors and democratic control by residents. The only place like that in the world is the Chinese Public Security Bureau," and pointed out, "Corrections should be made quickly."

He also emphasized that controversies over personnel authority, seen as conflicts between the government and prosecution, ultimately became the reason he entered politics. Kim said, "The pot is boiling, but all the fuel is taken away. Some high-ranking officials' investigative prosecutors protested, and the issue surfaced," adding, "As Professor Im Mi-ri said, 'Everyone except the Democratic Party' seems to be the demand of the times."

He strongly refuted allegations of political nature of the prosecution raised by some. Kim said, "The risk disappears only if you collude with the living power. But if you say such things when trying to walk a thorny path, it is inappropriate. Just look at Prosecutor General Yoon Seok-yeol?his family's matters were exposed, he was criticized everywhere, and his aides were all cut off. If you blame the prosecution with such nonsense, in my view, it is the 'prosecution omnipotence theory.'"

Regarding the Moon Jae-in administration, he criticized, "They advocate fairness and justice, but what the people, especially the youth, feel is 'double standards' and 'us-versus-them mentality.' The appearances shown by the government and ruling party in a series of investigations cannot be interpreted as fairness and justice. Everything can be explained by 'double standards' and 'us-versus-them mentality.'"

Below is the full interview.

- How are you currently active?

= I am meeting many people from various fields. I seek advice from political seniors and experts in prosecution investigation authority adjustment among legal professionals. I also met Rep. Kim Do-eup, a former prosecutor who declared he would not run again. He said, 'It is ridiculous that no one takes responsibility in front of the people even though the law is said to be wrong.'

- You joined the New Conservative Party, but it merged with the Liberty Korea Party.

= I never said I would not go to the Liberty Korea Party. The party sent a text message, but at that time, I had no intention of entering politics. When I resigned, rumors circulated that I had a secret agreement for nomination from the Korea Party. Just responding would cause talk. Later, in a radio interview, the host said, 'You read and ignored it,' and when I added a filler, it became so-called 'read and ignored.' Of course, even if I had received a formal request from the Korea Party, I would have gone to the New Conservative Party. (The merger) is like moving from an old house to a new one. I highly appreciate the Korea Party's decision. It takes courage for a party with over 100 members to follow the demand of a party with eight members and move to a new party. I see it as joining the big trend of reform conservatism.

- What made you decide to enter politics?

= I am an expert in prosecution investigation. I was very disappointed with the government's and ruling party's direction on investigation authority adjustment. Also, personnel issues. The pot is boiling, but all the fuel is taken away. Some high-ranking officials' investigative prosecutors protested, and the issue surfaced. What shocked me was that the accused person said they would have the HOCI investigate the Prosecutor General. Is this world reasonable? I thought the government and ruling party must be clearly judged. As Professor Im Mi-ri said, 'Everyone except the Democratic Party' seems to be the demand of the times.

- How do you think the public views the prosecution?

= I think it is an object of love and hate. Like a child who is really disliked but also highly expected. If they do well, are humble, and think from the people's perspective, they can always be embraced, but if they disappoint expectations, they are harshly criticized. I am a fan of professional baseball teams Hanwha, Kia, and Lotte. But why do Lotte fans criticize Lotte? Because it is their team. For those with power, the prosecution is like the 'One Ring.' Once they get it, they tend not to destroy the 'One Ring' or dismantle excessive power but use it as a means of power.

- Is the current power exhibiting such traits? Didn't the conservative opposition also use that 'ring' when they held power?

= The reason for the New Conservative Party is reflection. There were clear mistakes in the past, and parts that violated the fundamental values of conservatism, so reflection is necessary. Words alone mean nothing. There must be measures to prevent recurrence, pledging not to misuse that power again. When we get there, we must create a structure so that it cannot be used recklessly. I think that is the conclusion of reflection, which should be presented through laws and systems.

- The HOCI law and prosecution-police investigation authority adjustment bills have already passed the National Assembly.

= The criticism that the prosecution has omnipotent power or acts as a political tool mostly occurs in special investigations, not in criminal investigations. Special investigations should be regulated. Globally, there are few countries where the prosecution conducts so many direct investigations. Also, investigation is different from public safety. Public safety prioritizes efficiency to prevent burglaries. Investigation is different. When Professor Im Mi-ri was accused, investigating that is an investigation. If misused even slightly, there is a high risk of human rights violations. It must be controlled. There are two methods: first, judicial control by prosecutors; second, democratic control by residents. Only the Chinese Public Security Bureau eliminates both. Our country's investigation authority adjustment removes both controls. Investigations into the living power were transferred to the HOCI, and the prosecution was prohibited from such investigations. Also, the prosecution's securities crime investigation unit was dismantled. This is contrary to the global trend. Corrections should be made quickly.

- What about police reform?

= Civic groups including the Citizens' Coalition for Economic Justice formed an organization called the 'Information Police Abolition Network.' There are almost no countries where information and investigation are combined. The damage is well revealed in the Ulsan mayoral election interference case. I want to create a bill reflecting civic demands to separate information police from the investigation part. If judicial control is not done, democratic control must be strengthened. This includes the autonomous police system and separation of administrative and judicial police.

- But the bills have already passed the National Assembly and are about to be implemented, right?

= Ultimately, I think this system cannot last long because of the high risk of human rights violations. Even if the big framework changes later, urgent checks and balances must be created first.

- Some say the conservative opposition will abolish the HOCI law if they become the largest party.

= I was not strongly opposed to the HOCI itself. But the HOCI law can be abused endlessly if misused with bad intentions. Investigations into the living power are excluded, or there is a very high possibility of abuse that can pressure the investigation subject regarding the living power. Almost all legal scholars point this out. Our government says there is no bad DNA, but whether it exists or not, how can we prevent someone with bad DNA from going there? Rep. Kwon Eun-hee pointed out many problems at the end and tried to create alternatives. At least that level of supplementary measures should be in place. Otherwise, the HOCI will truly become a 'Yoon Seok-yeol investigation office.'

- Is it impossible to be free from the regime?

= It is completely impossible. The opposition party's recommendation is just formal. Either the HOCI appointments should be transferred to the National Assembly or a separate committee. It is just 'turning a blind eye.'

- Public opinion on the 'Cho Kuk investigation' seems to divide trust in the prosecution.

= I don't see it as a trust issue. The investigation method and volume regarding the living power were the same in the past during the anti-corruption and judicial scandal investigations. Even though it was the same, before it was praised as excellent, but now it is criticized as unreasonable. If it becomes a problem depending on the investigation target, it is not a trust issue but a partisanship issue.

- There are even talks that the prosecution will exert political influence in this election.

= If the prosecution tries to exert political influence, what would be the best way? They must collude with the living power. Then the risk disappears. Saying that someone trying to walk a thorny path wants to take an easy path is the same. If the problem was past collusion with power, the area of such investigations should have been reduced. But this government has expanded the special investigation area the most. The current government, which expanded politically motivated investigations, must take responsibility. So I think it is a groundless suspicion. Just look at Prosecutor General Yoon Seok-yeol?his family's matters were exposed, he was criticized everywhere, and his aides were all cut off. It is much more advantageous to keep investigating the opposition party. If you blame the prosecution with such nonsense, in my view, it is the 'prosecution omnipotence theory.'

- Is there resistance or organizational protection against the government's attempt to reduce prosecution powers?

= The Prosecutor General emphasizes direct and special investigations, and this government has protected that, hasn't it? They abolished the criminal division's investigation command and case closure. The claim that the special division does this to protect the criminal division is groundless. For example, after Cho Kuk became Minister of Justice, he said he would strengthen the criminal division and reduce direct investigations, but now they say they will separate investigation and prosecution. It is clear who changes words depending on circumstances?the prosecution or those advocating investigation authority adjustment. They abused prosecution reform to protect the living power.

- The Moon Jae-in administration emphasizes the 'candlelight spirit.' How do you evaluate it?

= I think it is dangerous. They advocate fairness and justice, but what the people, especially the youth, feel is 'double standards' and 'us-versus-them mentality.' The appearances shown by the government and ruling party in a series of investigations cannot be interpreted as fairness and justice. Everything can be explained by 'double standards' and 'us-versus-them mentality.'

- Could you be more specific?

= When criticizing Chief Presidential Secretary Woo Byung-woo, wasn't it about holding him accountable for failing to catch Choi Soon-sil (real name Choi Seo-won), the secret power? Comparing it to the current Chief Presidential Secretary's Office, it is questionable whether it has improved. The Ulsan election interference investigation is incomplete, and everyone knows why. There was an 'personnel massacre.' The Ulsan Police Chief met the ruling party's prominent candidate twice, requested information collection from the information police, scolded them for not doing well, and transferred them elsewhere even though it was not an investigation matter. There are many facts, so how would the past government have handled this? The standard must be the same. That is fairness.

- Do you think the regime will investigate Prosecutor Yoon Seok-yeol at the government level in the future?

= Didn't Blue House Secretary Choi Kang-wook reveal that himself? It is inappropriate to say it is an individual's voice. There are too many institutional devices that allow the HOCI to be abused like that. It may be right for the HOCI to investigate indiscriminately. The initiation of investigations should be strictly limited to cases requested by the National Assembly. It is important to create such laws.

- What about your personal future?

= I want to run directly in the region and be judged and chosen. The important thing is the party's decision. I think I should follow it. I did not start politics to defeat someone. I am an expert in the criminal justice system with sufficient practical experience. If the criminal justice system is flawed, the strong and wealthy have no problem, but the weakest suffer. But it is not even known. The person accused as the 8th suspect in the Hwaseong serial murder case was released after decades. Fixing such things is important. Becoming a political heavyweight by defeating someone is not important.

- There have been successive acquittals in trials related to judicial scandal.

= The acquittal rate in all cases is less than 0.6%. In France and Germany, it rises to 20%. Koreans think that if there is an acquittal, either side is wrong, but with a 20% acquittal rate, the prosecution's uselessness could be argued. The prosecution and court's positions should not coincide. It is democracy to pay attention to why the prosecution indicted and why the court acquitted in the judicial scandal cases.

- What about judicial reform?

= Our judiciary has many problems. I think people's right to a three-tier trial is violated. They receive trials from the same judges in an apprenticeship system. It is difficult to get different judgments.

- Please share your aspirations.

= Ultimately, controlling power is not about goodwill but systems. If power is strong and concentrated, even the best person will inevitably be distorted. For conservatism to reflect and present a new future to the people, power must be decentralized and institutional devices created to prevent reckless use. I dare to take on that role.